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Post by mrgrimsdale on Jun 23, 2008 19:12:16 GMT
A rod IS ordinary marking out.
Yes you have to be careful but only once. Marking up without a rod you have to be careful at very step. Rod reduces risk of error.
cheers
Jacob
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Post by Scrit on Jun 23, 2008 21:33:40 GMT
i could of course cut the all by the table saw, but what other methods, other than a spindle moulder ;D 1. Bandsaw 2. Radial arm saw with trenching head (i.e. a dado head) 3. Router table 4. Horizontal router table (which is effectiovely a mini-tenoner) If you want a potentially more accurate way to hand cut try this: 1. Work two housings to full tenon cheek depth either side if the piece using a shoulder or dado plane (or for that matter a plough or combi plane) . The dado plane's nickers will be a real asset here. 2. Plane off the excess with a jack or smoothing plane This presupposes that you can plane a straight and square housing, though........ as i have said before for most people who have returned, or never done woodworking before, then hand sawing is a major problem. I'd say it's largely a matter of practice. But then as I hand saw some wood most days, I would wouldn't I? Scrit |
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Post by engineerone on Jun 23, 2008 22:16:32 GMT
thing is scrit that you were taught to saw properly in the first case, so what you do now is basically following up. whereas for many of us, the basic training is lacking  and as alf said the saw may not be right either. still i am learning as i want. although to an extent i can plane reasonably well, but it is easier with a longer length of wood. paul  |
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Post by mrgrimsdale on Jun 24, 2008 8:12:51 GMT
thing is scrit that you were taught to saw properly in the first case, so what you do now is basically following up. whereas for many of us, the basic training is lacking Basic training usually means lots of practice, organised in a progressive way. I seem to remember spending a whole week doing half housings in 2x1". Some of the others got on more quickly, some didn't. And then for the rest of your life every time you do something it's another bit of practice. There isn't a sudden cut-off point where you've suddenly "got it". Sounds like you need loadsa practice Paul. Spend money on a pile of wood* instead of an expensive plane. Even if you turn it all into firewood it'll do your woodwork more good. cheers Jacob * PS e.g. £100 worth of 4ths redwood would take you a long way! PPS come to think we must have wasted tons of the stuff, though it was re-used in the process. Frinstance a team would make a sample pitch roof with long timbers and a very steep pitch. The next team would re-use the timbers, cut new joints and end up with a shallower pitch. And then again until un-useable. Getting a "new" bit of timber was a bonus. |
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Post by engineerone on Jun 24, 2008 9:32:17 GMT
but jacob it was having the expensive plane and discovering how much easier it made what i had thought was a difficult job, that led me to experimenting even more with my hand skills.  the thing about the m/t's is that the end results are basically hidden, so it is a decent practice. i was looking for any more expedient methods of cutting out the tenons, and it looks like i am not too far off course, all i need is the extra practice that making something brings.  i just try to make my learning process a productive one too. so sharper planes, decently sharpened chisels and making sure my saws are sharp, and i can cut vertically and horizontally square with them. paul |
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Post by mrgrimsdale on Jun 24, 2008 10:54:50 GMT
Better practice is a half housing, which doesn't hide your mistakes. At school we used to try carefully inserted shavings in wide gaps, but one tap and the whole thing sprang apart Multiples are good practice - a dozen little frames, 10 boxes etc. Throw away the duds, give the good ones away as Christmas presents. Don't be afraid of dumping it if it's not too good, or as an amateur you can end up with a house full of duds. cheers Jacob |
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Post by engineerone on Jun 24, 2008 11:19:55 GMT
you are for once stating something i agree with, i have made a number of lap joints, which i guess you might call half housings, and they are perhaps the most difficult so called simple joint to make. and you are right they are impossible to hide the mistakes on.  but at least with tables, i can use the mistakes ;D paul |
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Post by mrspanton on Jun 24, 2008 22:16:01 GMT
A rod IS ordinary marking out. Yes you have to be careful but only once. Marking up without a rod you have to be careful at very step. Rod reduces risk of error. cheers Jacob Tis true, take time and use the acurate ruler's and square's etc to do the drawing. Mark face side's/edge's on the rod, then on each component; If necessary add numbering on the rod AND the components for multiple components eg rail#1, rail#2 etc so you set out and fit up always with the same sequence. Then take all the sizes and positions from the wood rod to the wood components, then its a case of set the motrice guage to the mortice chisle, set out mortices and tennons using strict face side/face edge discipline, chop mortice, rip tennon c heeks, cross cut tennonn shuolder's. As little abstract ruler measuring as possible means greatly reduced chance of error. A rod has the real size there on a board. If your job came out wrong you made a mistake either drew your rod wrong, or took a wrong position off a good rod  . I prefer to do french style full size rods where its like a complete plan, not where you have every thing on a single lath, I find them harder to work with. |
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