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Post by RogerM on Jul 18, 2008 15:45:01 GMT
This is some fine detail off the side of a cabinet I spotted in a shop window in Pimlico. I want to incorporate it in an oak bookcase, set in to the surface so that both sides are flush like the right hand side of the feature. How would you set about it? My best guess is to create the 1/2 round inset on the router table and then carefully cut into it with an appropriate sized gouge - but how would you create the hemispherical bit in the middle? The original full size photo may help. There has to be a simple answer - it's just a case of thinking of it, unless of course it is yet another example of fine craftsmanship that we have forgotten how to do. Whilst you are about it, if you have any idea as to how you would tackle the Linen Fold, please feel free to elucidate!
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Post by davyowen on Jul 18, 2008 16:12:31 GMT
Is it all carved or could the half-sphere have been glued on/in? Perhaps a dowel that is appropriately rounded and then glued into a hole after the cutouts have been made?
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Post by ''The village idiot'' on Jul 18, 2008 16:55:32 GMT
It goes by the name of cats eye moulding by some cabinetmakers.
I realise that you would like to duplicate the moulding but youmay wish to consider purchasing it off the shelf.
Winther Browne did one, item No C586 9.5mm x 5mm x 1500 but I think it is only available in beech.
Also
Richard Burbidge did one, item CD07 10mm x 5mm x 1500 not sure of the timber.
If you can only get the moulding beech then bleach it in a A & B bleach (this is very, very strong bleach) you can then french polish the moulding to look like oak.
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Post by engineerone on Jul 18, 2008 18:17:50 GMT
blimey that goes back. if by hand, seem to remember it goes somewhat like this. get yourself a gouge that is the same diameter as the bit in the middle. drive that down to the depth you want. then use a swan necked gouge to cut the sides down by using long slow sweeping strokes until you have reached the depth. if possible that gouge should also have a shape like the half round to ensure you do not bite it away. finally you have to fiddle the bit in the middle, and basically one could go round it with a kind of hollow drill. actually if there were more space, you might well be able to use the outside of a mechanical mortice chisel without the chisel, in a pillar drill it is similar to doing it in stone, and you do not there have the option to stick a bit of beech in ;D the linen fold is basically easy in the length of the door, and of course many of the router companies do tools for it. the real problem is making the shape top and bottom, and there are router cutters for that, but also you could gouge it. paul
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Post by mrgrimsdale on Jul 18, 2008 20:08:47 GMT
Is it a wardrobe? Looks like all machine to me. Give-away being the crude detail at the top of the linenfold. It's gone wrong; an overhead router or something, set too deep. Overall impression: Edwardian, shop-fitting, or classy mass-produced furniture. The bead too regular and perfect to be hand done. Been recently cleaned up and Briwaxed? Was probably dark varnish before.
cheers Jacob
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Post by ''The village idiot'' on Jul 18, 2008 20:28:03 GMT
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Post by ''The village idiot'' on Jul 18, 2008 20:40:01 GMT
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Post by nickw on Jul 18, 2008 21:14:40 GMT
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Post by mrgrimsdale on Jul 18, 2008 21:46:13 GMT
Those pip cutters plus those linenfold cutters = dogs breakfast It's not good quality stuff to start with, why attempt to copy it?* cheers Jacob PS though I like this sort of early industrial stuff and have a few examples myself; several wardrobes and other bits with machine or production-line hand-carving. And it's dirt cheap; quite fancy stuff at auctions going for a tenner - incredible value esp compared with Ikea, MDF etc *Most things faked with a router tend to look just that, IMHO
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Post by jfc on Jul 18, 2008 22:14:29 GMT
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Post by nickw on Jul 19, 2008 7:47:32 GMT
Steady Jason, the Lagacy's good, but I'm not sure how you would use it to do this job.
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Post by ''The village idiot'' on Jul 19, 2008 8:46:41 GMT
Please accept my sincere apologies for duplicating your link in my earlier posting.
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Post by Alf on Jul 19, 2008 9:28:24 GMT
Don't give a damn who posted it first - both of them just take me to the index page.
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Post by ''The village idiot'' on Jul 19, 2008 9:53:55 GMT
Don't give a damn who posted it first - both of them just take me to the index page. You are correct which ever link you click on first you can get the index page, but the second link you follow will get you the Pip cuter page and it don’t mater which link you use first that’s very interesting. If you follow nickw link first you will get the index page. If you follow the idiot’s link directly after using nickw link then you get the pip cutter page and vice versa. As I say very interesting. It would be interesting to know if it only happened after I duplicated nickw post.
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Post by jfc on Jul 19, 2008 10:20:10 GMT
I think TVI is making a point that he posted it first
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Post by Alf on Jul 19, 2008 13:53:20 GMT
I think TVI is making a point that he posted it first You think?
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Post by nickw on Jul 19, 2008 15:32:25 GMT
Yeah sorry TVI, your link didn't work for me so I added a new one - which apparently doesn't work for anyone else. P'raps I should've added an explanation at the time ....
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Post by ''The village idiot'' on Jul 19, 2008 15:56:51 GMT
Yeah sorry TVI, your link didn't work for me so I added a new one - which apparently doesn't work for anyone else. P'raps I should've added an explanation at the time .... No apology required.
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Post by jake on Jul 19, 2008 20:13:03 GMT
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Post by wizer on Jul 19, 2008 20:29:24 GMT
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dunbarhamlin
Full Member
Lutherie with Luddite Tendancies
Posts: 244
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Post by dunbarhamlin on Jul 19, 2008 20:33:46 GMT
Oooooooo must be Typhoon
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Post by jake on Jul 19, 2008 22:01:16 GMT
Ha ha, Wizer, very clever.
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Post by RogerM on Jul 20, 2008 10:46:22 GMT
Thanks guys for all your contributions. Most helpful.
I think linen folds would be too fussy in the sides of a bookcase, although I love them in the side panels of blanket chests, so that's a project for the future.
What I have planned is some furniture for the lounge in English Oak ( I have 25 cu ft sticked up in the garage) and I'm looking for a common theme to incorporate, starting with a bookcase, and this beading caught my eye and I was wondering how it was done. I think if I was to try it, I'd cut the 1/2 round bead on the router table, cut the pips with the pip cutter, and then pare around it with a gouge. As Jacob has said, not entirely certain it's worth the trouble, and once started I'd be past the point of no return. I may just try it on an offcut to satisfy my curiosity tho'. That would also give me a clue as to the time involved and whether it was worth the effort.
However, I can't help thinking that some simple flutes may be a more elegant solution, and so very much easier and quicker to make, although as I'm making this for ourselves time is not a consideration - I'm happy for it to take as long as it takes.
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Post by colincott on Jul 21, 2008 9:28:14 GMT
Hi RogerM I got your message about this. Did you want help in making it yourself ? I can show you how to but will have to make up some moulding which should not take long.
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Post by RogerM on Jul 22, 2008 9:07:06 GMT
Thanks Colin. Just curious for its own sake, really, as to how this is made - it looks as tho' it should be simple with the right tools or technique - it's just a case of finding out what that technique is. Am I on the right lines or way adrift with the proposal I outlined above? I may incorporate a short length (say 30 cms) into the top of a bookcase, set in to english oak.
Many thanks.
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