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Post by dirtydeeds on Dec 4, 2007 23:02:53 GMT
its unfinished, just to keep jfc happy   lighting detail  |
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Post by mailee on Dec 5, 2007 21:28:34 GMT
That looks nice deeds, what is the grille material in the doors? It looks unusual. very nice though. ;D
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Post by jfc on Dec 5, 2007 22:32:46 GMT
 You wanna see the price of that stuff ! P.s. I think it was Dom that mentioned the finishing thing ;D
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Post by mel on Dec 5, 2007 22:39:45 GMT
you are a true craftsman sir !!!
i like those lights
mel
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Post by dom on Dec 6, 2007 6:26:53 GMT
Nice work DD, yes it was me  |
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Post by thallow on Dec 6, 2007 7:16:24 GMT
Very nice DD, where do the wires for the lights go?
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Post by paulchapman on Dec 6, 2007 7:53:55 GMT
That's nice, DD. Cheers Paul |
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Post by dirtydeeds on Dec 6, 2007 19:36:23 GMT
the door grilles are handmade brass at £50 a square foot
yes................................. you read it correctly.............. handmade.......... one single square foot costs £50
behind the brass is a back panel which is painted a dark brown (customers choice)
i wanted them to go for black
the wires for the lighting are in a 8mm gap between the lower and upper section
the cabinet is made up of eight separate units
the base
three base cabinets
top and two lower sections
two upper sections
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Telos
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Post by Telos on Dec 7, 2007 9:22:09 GMT
...well, I can appreciate the effort, but can I say I don't like it without getting lynched???
I don't care how much the brass was it's just ugly. The LED downlights look a little too cramped together. The right hand side of the base is "chamfered" off from the divide whilst the shelves above it don't match. Also, the grain of the backing runs vertically on the right and horizontally everywhere else. Oh well, that's just my 2 cents, feel free to disagree. I'll go and sit in the corner again now.
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Post by jfc on Dec 10, 2007 22:53:36 GMT
;D Tell it like it is pal . To be honest i have got better at my job because people online have pulled my work apart and mentioned the defects or bad practice . I dont try and use all the materials now i just buy more and save the rest for the next job .... or give them to Paul ;D If the customer is happy then thats all that matters but myself i like to be happy with the job and not let any of this lot pick the bones out of it ;D
Just my 2p worth aswell
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Post by evergreen on Dec 10, 2007 23:14:02 GMT
Telos
You're right about the grain direction . That would bug me too.
Regards.
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Telos
Full Member
Posts: 123
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Post by Telos on Dec 11, 2007 10:46:42 GMT
... If the customer is happy then thats all that matters To a certain extent that's true but then some customers talk total crap and have very poor taste  but myself i like to be happy with the job and not let any of this lot pick the bones out of it ;D Just my 2p worth aswell Well, that does lead to an easy life but I can't stand it when "what do you think?" turns into a public back slapping contest - no one learns anything from that. I was hoping more people might criticize (or defend), none of this is personal and it shouldn't hurt to hear different opinions. I was watching the tumbleweed blow past and was wondering if anyone was going to respond to my provocation.... |
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Post by jaco on Dec 11, 2007 11:30:12 GMT
Well, if we are open about it ........... Not a design and finish that i would put in our house.  |
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Post by dirtydeeds on Dec 13, 2007 20:06:46 GMT
in response to telos and one or two others
i realise that you are wanting to give constuctive critisism and take it in that light, no you wont get lynched but you be be let off the hook if your comments arnt reasonable
so i will make a few comments in reply and would like your response to a couple of them
the comment on the brass is highly subjective and totally down to personal taste, it is the clients choice like it or not it is of no relevance to me or you
the design brief the clients gave was for a wash of light they specifically didnt want spot lights and they mustnt be seen when the client is sat down.
the spacing of the lights achieves the main requirement (the wash of light)
the bit you dont know is that the light baffle is not in place yet.
personally i think it will make the light baffle will make the finished transom between the upper and lower sections too heavy / overpowering. so again it is of no relevance to me or you
the comment on the LEFT side chamfer baffles me, its the right side thats chamfered
if infact you mean the right side. can you explain what you mean by it looks wrong (the "counter" top is 600 wide while the shelving above is only 270)
the bit you cant see is that the right hand chamfer matches chamfer of the wall on the left hand side but is obscured by the curtain
if you do mean the right side i would like your commets on how it could be done better. ie HOW do i make the upper chamfer match the lower chamfer given the dimensions above
as for the grain direction i see your point and agree
the comment on "if youd have it in your own house" thats totally subjective and of no relevance. it wouldnt fit in my house.
the cleint wanted "imposing" to explain a bit better the picture rail is at 8 and a half feet. the ceiling is just short of 11 feet. so i think ive got "imposing"
the finish is medium oak wax on white ameican oak. thats subjective. personally i love it
now my final question, the oak is the clients requirement.
on the basis that the oak is a given requirement you cant change. what finish would you have used in my place
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Post by engineerone on Dec 13, 2007 20:24:08 GMT
deeds like many i think it is a decent and imposing piece of kit, i think though that the horizontal pattern across the back is what is causing most concern. personally i try to have my grain in these circumstances vertical, but as you say it is up to what the client wants. paul |
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Post by dirtydeeds on Dec 13, 2007 20:26:50 GMT
so....... 3 of the negative comments are totally irrellevant because they are either subjective or meet the clients design brief
1 needs more explanation
and 1 is correct (grain direction) i have learnd something
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Post by dirtydeeds on Dec 13, 2007 20:35:49 GMT
engineer1
thank you for giving a preferred grain direction
regardless of the mismatch (which was a mistake) i did consider the grain direction on the large section
it was chosen as horizontal due to the width, 1535, the back is oak faced mdf and i considered that the risk of having a vertical joint that wasnt totally flush out weighed the horizonal grain pattern
i would like some comments on how this would be overcome
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Post by jfc on Dec 13, 2007 21:47:07 GMT
Re the grain direction , there is nothing that could be done because the bottom part of the unit has no divides to hide a joint . I would have done the same as you have there but also made the corner part the same .
The brass grill , i have used this in the past and it is one of the most expensive grills , it is actually very nice and that may not come across in a picture but trust me as a non brass lover , it's nice .
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Post by engineerone on Dec 13, 2007 22:03:38 GMT
not trying to be too much of a smart ar*e is it not possible to get veneered board at widths of up to 5 feet??? if you can get normal boards that width then i just wonder?? but you could have made the upper shelf items vertical. as for the brass, it works . paul |
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Stree
Junior Member
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Post by Stree on Dec 13, 2007 23:46:27 GMT
Regarding the back and the horizontal grain direction. I have to agrre, it would have been more elegant and pleasing to the eye if it had rin vertically, but if the recess and the shelves are going to be filled then its hardly going to be noticable.
If I had had that decision to contend with and given the span, IE: more than a standard 1220mm board width, ( and yes there are wider boards, but not as easily available and therefore not so many to pick and choose from re matching up etc) I would have considered lining the back with a thin section T&G in oak, so that there is no limit ( theoretically) to the width.
The other option I would probably have considered given the board size restraints would be to follow the lines from the upper verticals and echoed them in the back to act as stiffeners and joining pieces.
All in all the grain would definitely be more pleasing if it ran from top to bottom.
However if the client wanted a clear back in that section then the divides are not an option and its back to considering T&G as the only option and if the client does not want that either.................................Sure we have all been there !
As JFC says, the pics are hardly the best way to judge the piece by, and I like anything made of oak, so I am biased *
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Telos
Full Member
Posts: 123
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Post by Telos on Dec 14, 2007 9:59:51 GMT
in response to telos and one or two others i realise that you are wanting to give constuctive critisism and take it in that light, no you wont get lynched but you be be let off the hook if your comments arnt reasonable so i will make a few comments in reply and would like your response to a couple of them the comment on the brass is highly subjective and totally down to personal taste, it is the clients choice like it or not it is of no relevance to me or you Hi dd, glad you didn't flip as I was a little brusque with my comments. Obviously, commenting on details like the brass is highly subjective but it still remains relevant. If you are making a design that should "appeal" then having a singular customer who likes it shouldn't be a carte blanche to produce anything. I believe it should be the task of those who have been educated in design and form to teach those who haven't, what is "acceptable" and what is not. That might sound a little pretentious or arrogant but can you imagine a world where everyone has the right to design and build their own house? It would be bloody awful. If a customer still insists, then I know from experience (not woodwork) that it just has to be done. That shouldn't prevent you from trying to educate the customer and persuade him to take a different route though. Put it this way, I find it extremely difficult, if not impossible, to allow a design to be passed that I am not satisfied with. If my name is going to be associated with the design then it must meet my standards. Well, that's fair enough then and the brief explains your choice. I felt the modern LEDs to be totally out of place but if they are covered, then it's probably fine. Still disagree. It is relevant. You have to make it - if you are unconvinced of the elegance of the design you could try explaining an alternative. They are hiring you as an expert - try giving an expert opinion. You should be happy with the work you supply. I never said left! I said right. I don't think it matters that the wall is chamfered off, it appears to be hidden by the curtain (permanently?) so the unit remains asymmetrical. My only concern is, in plan view the shelves contour do not match the base unit and that simply doesn't look right to me. Either the shelves should match the base or vice versa. I hope that explains my perspective a little more - I simply see "it's what the customer wants" as a cop out. If you don't agree with something then it should be said and the customer should be made aware. As an expert your opinion is relevant and the customer should know when you are doing something which could (should?) be done differently. IMHO the customer certainly is not always king. |
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Post by dirtydeeds on Dec 14, 2007 22:08:03 GMT
telos
i FULLY understand your perspective
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Telos
Full Member
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Post by Telos on Dec 15, 2007 16:19:44 GMT
telos i FULLY understand your perspective Well that was short and sweet! ...and someone very sad obviously took offence and smote my karma   |
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Post by dirtydeeds on Dec 16, 2007 14:42:58 GMT
its clear you dont like brass, thats personal predudice
LED lights again your personal predudice
you do not like asymetry, thats your personal preducice again
then you decide to launch a personal attack
FIRST
when you design something you are an the "expert" who is "educated in design", i aparantly am not
SECOND
when you bow to customer demands and specific wishes, its ok, when i do it i am copping out and havnt tried to educate the customer
conclusion
you are arrogant predudiced bully who likes destroying others work and character.
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Post by dirtydeeds on Dec 16, 2007 15:47:34 GMT
ps
yes i did smite you for your personal attack
it was not for your highly predudiced comments maskarading as constructive critisim or your arrogance
however
i see somebody else agreed with your personal attack on me and has restored your karma
yes i know ive not been perfect elsewhere but ive learned it isnt good
i dont expect you will change
people with the overwhelming arrogance of "No offense" in the Fast Show dont comprehend or understand
nor will i be surprised if you continue in the same vein and make further comments
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You wanna see the price of that stuff ! 
