New workshop

[sainty]

Hi

Looks like I found you all at last!

I'm thinking of leasing a unit/workshop.

I've been getting some work recently making up some display booths for a bathroom retailer. If all goes well there might be enough work next year for me to set up my own workshop (fingers crossed).

Has anyone else been through this recently? I'd love to hear people thoughts/experiences.

I've been asked to make a kitchen (for family member), which is something that I would like to get into. This would be a good opportunity to get some photos for the portfolio, rather than the standard installs that I have been doing. The whole fitted furniture thing appeals to me for some reason. Whats the market like at the moment for handmade/bespoke furniture, wheres it going?


What sort of size workshop will I need. As a finger in the air I guessed at 1000 ft2 - how bigs yours? The rental on something this size round here is about 8.5k, what other costs are there? How much are business rates?


So many questions spinning around in my head!!!

Any info gratefully received

rgds


Saint

[thallow]

M'fraid I am only a hobbyist woodie so no advice that is valuable on a workshop however SWMBO recently finished a lease on a shop unit (approx 60 ft by 40 ft) and one thing that really took her by surprise was the cost of business rates, in our area it was around 800 pounds pa.

Not a huge amount I know, however just something to bear in mind - all the little costs tend to build up and they are there every month regardless of how busy you are/are not

Please do not take this as being negative - just offering my (v limited) experience! ;D

As a wise man once said - it is only the end of the road if you fail to make the turn! (or a wheel falls off! ;D ;D ;D)

[dom]

Hi Sainty, welcome.

1000 sq.ft starting out should be okay, but it depends on the size of your machinery, if you're going down the fitted furniture route you'll be using a lot of board material and you'll find that 10 by 5's can be economical, so you may want to buy a saw with a sliding carriage of say 3metres and that will need infeed and outfeed tables of a couple of metres each.
Then you'll need somewhere to stack your boards while you're sizing etc. so a minimum height of 10-11 ft. below the lights.
If you intend to do your own finishing, 200 sq.ft. should be adequate. Make sure you can expel fumes to outside areas.
Rent, rates, INSURANCE, wages, N.I., tax, electricity, heating( don't use electric to heat it'll cost you a fortune.
Parking, space to unload and accept deliveries. Somewhere to dump your rubbish(you'll be amazed how much MDF waste there'll be) unless you're allowed to use a woodburner.
Security.
Don't undervalue yourself or your work, find out what other(reputable) companies charge in your area.
Don't overstretch yourself, if you can't fulfill a contract on time, be honest, in the long run you'll work better and happier.
When quoting a price, do not leave drawings with the customer( they will use them to get other quotes) if they insist tell them that there is a cost which will be refunded should the contract go through. Take at least 40% deposit on order
Always pay your suppliers on time.
A mobile number on your headed notepaper is unprofessional and looks fly by night.
Fingers tired now.
Someone else's turn ;D

Whoops, Good Luck

[engineerone]

basic things to consider,

as dom says so far all is right.

get yourself a cheap computer and printer, and buy one of the two or three cheap accounting packages, i use mind your own business. get into the habit of doing your accounts every night, it will then only take a couple of minutes, and always be up to date.

in principal think like this 1/3 materials, 1/3 overheads, and 1/3 wages and profit. remember for every job, you need to allow for the cost of screws, hinges, paint brushes etc, not just the wood.

in the first year you will not make a profit, but it is quite sensible to try and put aside 10-20% of the money to cover any tax claims.

always be prepared to say no for a job, even if it offers more money cause it is easier to keep customers, and more profitable too, but if you delay a job cause some one has come along and offered you a bundle to help them out of the pooh, you can guarantee that they will not offer you the next job, but look for someone else who might be desperate, whilst the customer you let down by delaying their job won't want to give you work in the future.

remember you do not need audited accounts, but it will be worth getting the advice of an accountant to set things up properly. and the tidier your paperwork, the less aggro you will get later.

as dom says, a proper address and grown up telephone will say a great deal for your professionalism. if youhave a van i would not suggest getting it signwritten otherwise people may well feel invited to break in.

make sure you have proper security at the shop, and lock down the tools.

remember the basic rule, all customers are important as long as they pay on time, and an existing customer is the cheapest one to service since they know your work and are happy with you.
however do try not to allow one person to be your sole customer, it will cause you long term problems if they go bust.

in your costings allow for 10% extra as a holdback, but aim to make all your normal profit prior to that, and look for the hold back as investment for the future money.

remember to be tough on debt collection cause cash flow failures will kill you. take stage payments, and always get paid for the material before you start. also try to ensure that every week you take enough money for your personal overheads, rent, utilities and food.

good luck

paul

[sainty]

Thanks everyone. I really appreciate all the good advice that you have given me.

It's really exciting to be even thinking about it. Its something that I have been wanting to do for a while now. For the last few years I have been developing property, a "beenyite" if you like. During that time I have always tried to move myself along the path to setting up my own workshop but you get a bit bogged down with things. With the property market a bit nervous at the moment I have been trying to get into the refurbishment market. I've done a few kitchens/bathrooms for other people (other than the ones that I have been doing for myself) and whilst I enjoy that I would prefer to get into the handmade/bespoke side of things. I know that this sounds like a bit of a leap but I'm pretty confident of my own abilities, and theres no-one else that spends more time researching and learning than I do!

Luckily, I was asked if I could make some bathroom display units, nothing special just unfinished MDF. "Of course" I said and they turned out pretty well. I was even more lucky that the other joinery company asked to produce a prototype turned out some pretty awful stuff. So hopefully next year I will get a steady flow of work which should ease the burden of starting up a workshop.

Ok, hands up i've never made a kitchen before. However I've made some built in wardrobes and cupboards that have come out well and they were built on the same principal. I am toying with getting one of the CMT

"]http://www.axminster.co.uk/product-CMT-3-Piece-Kitchen-Door-Set-211039.htm]

cutter sets to produce a few doors. As I mentioned before I have been asked if I could make a kitchen, whats the worst that could happen!!!!

Its all in my head at the moment, but it if I can try and get some sort of contract for the bathroom stuff I might just be able to make the leap.

So after all those ramblings I'd like to say thanks again for you input, and i'd love to hear more about how everyone else started up.

I'm in Southampton, if theres anyone locally that would like to share experiences i'd love to get together to see how you work.

Anyway, enough from me.

rgds


Sainty

[jfc]

;D

[sainty]

"tits up".......no chance mate....how hard can it be? ;D ;D I mean have you seen some of the people in this game, northern monkeys and barro' boys......

[dom]

So Sainty, by the way you write I'd say your'e a Londoner or very close, that makes you a barra boy ;D
Welcome to the club and may your God help you.