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Post by thallow on May 9, 2008 18:13:56 GMT
Ok with all the 'nice' offcuts from my frame and panel cupboard - I am thinking of using them to make a chopping board:  1 Is oak OK for this (ie are the spores food safe?) 2 Whats the best food safe glue? 3 Whats a nice safe finish? Cheers  |
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Post by jonnyd on May 9, 2008 20:29:17 GMT
Hi Oak is not generally recommended as a chopping board because of the coarser grain and natural tannins in the wood. I generally use endgrain beech or maple with titebond 3 adhesive and either leave unfinished or a apply a foodsafe oil finish
Jon
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Post by engineerone on May 9, 2008 23:21:15 GMT
the big joke is of course that the eu tried to stop us all using wooden chopping boards claiming they were unsafe. so they tried to make it law that you had to use plastic boards. then some bright scientists did a number of experiments and discovered that the natural oils and so on in wood were better and more effective disinfectants than just washing plastic.  so there you go, sometimes you can defeat the beaurocrats of europe. ;D paul |
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Post by mrgrimsdale on May 10, 2008 7:49:32 GMT
Oooh those euro bureaucrats aren't they a pain? dear o dear ;D ;D and who wants straight cucumbers - ridiculous Oak'd do but not ideal. Any glue - unless you intend to eat the board. No finish, as it gets chopped about, but a wipe over with oil would be OK, or you could fry it gently in hot olive oil to get it to soak in. You leave it in the oil as it cools down and it pulls the oil in, as the air in the wood shrinks. cheers Jacob |
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Post by engineerone on May 10, 2008 10:45:19 GMT
actually jacob, the straight cucumbers were more likely to do with tesco or asda than the beauros. get more in a packet ;D difficult to understand how someone who seems so much for the worker should support the decisions made by unelected officials who are really only interested in using their budgets, and not to help the union become more customer friendly. these guys want to control all our daily life and you seem to feel that is ok.  paul |
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Post by Scrit on May 11, 2008 7:07:17 GMT
As Paul says timbers are probably a better choice than plastic, but personally I'd avoid any timber with tannin in it, e.g. oak, walnut and mahogany simply because water + tannin + steel knives = black stains (ferric oxide). I agree with Johnny that tannin can also taint the food, so that's another reason to avoid it. And as he says oak is open pored and relatively coarse so it won't wear well. What you want for a good working chopping board is a light coloured (so the timber doesn't colour your food), fine-grained and preferably non-tropical timber such as beech, sycamore or maple, etc. although in the Med they use olive wood for the same purpose. Presumably fruitwoods such as apple or pear might also work well
For glue I'd use a UF such as Cascamite (or whatever it's called these days). The glue needs to be at least exterior grade. My old maple chopping bpoard is now nearly 30 years old and I made that by butt jointing and glueing with UF glue. It did start to delaminate 5 or 6 years back so I re-ripped it and glued it up again and it's still going strong
I've always oiled my own chopping boards with olive oil, but my two boards are in regular use and ar oiled and scraped a couple of times a week. Other people use walnut oil (not good for nut allergy sufferers), but I'm told that oil can go rancid. Personally, I've never experienced that
Scrit
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Post by tusses on Jun 1, 2008 8:38:39 GMT
Ive been reading up on this too I wanted to use oak - because it's what I have lying around. I googled 'oak cutting board' and found a few 'reputable' places selling them - John Lewis was one. So - in the next couple of days I will be making one from oak . When I get myself some beach - I will make another  I have Ash too - but that seems to be generally a no go due to the openness of the end grain - altho, I have plenty of ash too, so I might give it a go. worst that can hapen is , it's rubbish ! as for finishes. the only oil I have found with no debate around it is food grade mineral oil. Ikea sell it for a few quid a bottle. Everyone seems to agree that veg oil is a no-no as it turns rancid (love that word! ), but a few have said olive oil seems ok, whilst others say it can go off. Nut oils - such as walnut and tung oil have the risk to those with nut alergies, so I wouldn't use it just in case ! Saying that - alot of peeps dont use any finish. My last cutting board was just a piece of pine board - no finish. I cut it out when we were having a BBQ one day just make shift. I used to thoroughly bleach it every time I used it for meat etc and it lasted about 6 years ! until it split down the middle. |
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Post by tusses on Jun 2, 2008 12:14:05 GMT
ok - an update.
after lots of googling I found that mineral oil is available from the 'drug store' for use as a laxative. After blank expresions in our 'chemists' I google some more for the american / english tranlation !
Liquid Paraffin was the only reference I could fing , so off to the chemist, and sure enough they have liquid paraffin and it its a mild laxative.
£1.20 for a small bottle 125ml
I'll let you all know how it goes
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Post by thallow on Jun 2, 2008 19:29:04 GMT
ok - an update. after lots of googling I found that mineral oil is available from the 'drug store' for use as a laxative.  ha ha what can i say! oh and welcome btw! |
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Post by tusses on Jun 2, 2008 19:53:13 GMT
ok - made a quick chopping board from ash and tried the liquid paraffin ....  seems ok |
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Post by craigmarshall on Jun 2, 2008 22:24:44 GMT
ok - made a quick chopping board from ash and tried the liquid paraffin .... Looks great - how did you get such a clean finish on the end grain? Can you stick it through the thicknesser and then cut off the torn-out piece later? (Or chamfer it first?) Or block/LA plane? Also - I would have thought that ash and oak are about as open-grained as each other. I often think of ash as a whiter, non-durable, less interesting looking oak with no visible stretch-marks (medullary rays). I also wouldn't have thought that it being open grained would matter much. Cheers, Craig |
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Post by tusses on Jun 2, 2008 23:14:29 GMT
I used a belt sander to clean the faces - held in place on a shooting board.
hang on and I'll do the WIP, pics.
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Post by tusses on Jun 2, 2008 23:16:01 GMT
found a bit of an ash plank  I marked my cutting line for a straight edge  the I pinned a scrap bit of skirting boar parallel to the cutting line (pinned into the waste) and made the cut   with one straight edge, I cut the opposite edge and cleaned up the board in the thicknesser  Then I ripped it into strips  then the strips in half  before gluing up  then when the glue had dried , I cross cut intot strips and glued up again - with the end grain upwards  a bit of sanding with the belt sander, then wet to raise the grain  then a bit more sanding and a coating of mineral oil (liquid paraffin) and we're ready to go I'm quite pleased with my 1st chopping board ! next time I might use the band saw to rip into strips, as the large kerf cuts on the table saw soon add up to fewer inches on the final board !!! hope you all enjoyed the little WIP pics Rich |
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Post by craigmarshall on Jun 3, 2008 6:26:42 GMT
hope you all enjoyed the little WIP pics Very informative thanks! I did a chess board a while ago, and I used some similar techniques, except I didn't have end grain pointing upwards at the end. Yours has come out lovely. I've made a few chopping boards for family, but they've just been single pieces of wood, with a contrast stripe inlaid round the top edge. I'd like to have done away with the stripe and done an end grain one! Cheers, Craig |
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Post by jaco on Jun 4, 2008 4:29:26 GMT
A mate of mine also finishes off his boards with mineral oil (liquid paraffin)
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Post by Scrit on Jun 6, 2008 17:46:44 GMT
I wanted to use oak - because it's what I have lying around. I googled 'oak cutting board' and found a few 'reputable' places selling them - John Lewis was one. For "reputable" read "fashionable". It's not the same. Open grain timbers hold liquids, and therefore microbes from the cutting process (and so be a greater health hazard). They will also stain more readily. That's why traditionally only beech, sycamore, maple and in the Med olive were used. Oak, mahogany and walnut all contain tannin. This is released in the presence of water, such as the juice from vegetables, and creates mild tannic acid which not only turns carbon steel knives black (ferric oxide), but can also taint food (well, I can taste it, and I know I'm not alone) as for finishes. the only oil I have found with no debate around it is food grade mineral oil. A.k.a. liquid paraffin. A LAXATIVE! Everyone seems to agree that veg oil is a no-no as it turns rancid (love that word! ), but a few have said olive oil seems ok, whilst others say it can go off. Oh gawd, the chattering classes are at work again telling their urban myth. I wonder how many of these people have ever used an oiled board? My main maple board is now pushing 30 years odf age and has been treated with olive oil at least monthly for all of that time. It has NEVER gone rancid. But then it is scraped two or three times a week and turned daily. And it is used regularly, not just sat there to be admired. The use of olive oil is normal in many countries, so where does this myth originate? Probably from those folk who have kitchens for show but cannot cook....... Scrit |
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Post by Alf on Jun 6, 2008 20:08:43 GMT
Why use an oiled board at all? My folks have had a butcher's block these past, ooo, at least 35 years - probably more, but I'm too young... - and it just gets wiped over day to day and a scrub with a brush under hot water as required (we refer to it as "scrubbing the decks" 'cos my old man is ex-Navy and tends to approach the task as though he had a holystone to do it with). Waste of oil. ;D Cheers, Alf |
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Post by thallow on Jun 9, 2008 14:18:47 GMT
Tussess great looking board - and excellent wip pics - I paid about 35 quid for something similar a few yrs back (b4 I was into wood!) - gives an idea for all those offcuts huh!
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Post by engineerone on Jun 20, 2008 20:32:42 GMT
checking out about morticing etc, i came across jeff gorman's site and found an interesting link to chopping board hygiene. other bits about hse on table saws are good too www.amgron.clara.net/index.htmbasics are as i thought, that plastics are not better than wood. paul |
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I have Ash too - but that seems to be generally a no go due to the openness of the end grain - altho, I have plenty of ash too, so I might give it a go. worst that can hapen is , it's rubbish !
